What Americans Read
At the checkout line of my local grocery store, two headlines caught my eye.
The first angered me. It is a tabloid expose about Obama’s supposed “top secret” meeting with “Muslims.” It refers to a “shocking pact with the enemy.” I love how this garbage rag equates “Muslims” with “the enemy.”
I know few people take these publication seriously (I hope), but our grocery lines should not be polluted with such racist trash.
The second amused me in a very juvenile way but then inspired deeper thoughts. “Why Angelina is Hiding the Twins” it reads. Naturally, “twins” evoked the slang term for breasts — yes, I am part ignoramus.
My second thought was why the hell should the public have access to stars’ children? The rapacious voyeurism of such celebrity media is quite disturbing. However, I reasoned, that this is the cost of stardom; there has to be a down-side and this is it. With all the privilege, influence and money they get, celebrities sacrifice their and their families’ privacy; so it’s a trade-off of sorts, and one that reflects poorly on star-stalkers, our celebrity-worship culture, and the celebrities themselves.
That first one really terrifies me. I know that the National Examiner is meant to be absolutely sensationalist, but seriously?
My favorite headline this week was "Biggest Loser Wedding." My Syrian houseguest was like HUH?
You realize you aren't Muslim, right?
What difference does it make if he or she is Muslim or not? I'm white and I get offended when people discriminate against blacks. Is that wrong too?
What difference does it make if he or she is Muslim or not?
You don't think it makes a difference, whether Will is an Arab Christian or an Arab Muslim?
Interesting.
I'm white and I get offended when people discriminate against blacks. Is that wrong too?
Possibly. You obviously mean you get offended when WHITES discriminate against blacks, since you said you were white rather than saying "I'm not black". So, based on the wording of your statement there, it seems that subconsciously you only consider whites to be people. A pretty racist mentality, politically correct "outrage" against racism aside.
Do you think it matters whether you are make or female, when you use the name of a sexual position as your blog id? If you're female then you're pretty kinky to chose that as what you want to be known by, and if you're male it's pretty sexist. I'm guessing you are male, and consider yourself to be all in favor of feminism. Am I right?
No Craig, you're wrong. I'm an atheist, I can't stand Christianity or Islam or Judaism, but my recognition that the practitioners of those religions are people and don't deserve to be discriminated against is what drives me to defend. I, for example, may defend Muslims more in this particular forum, because Arabs are most often Muslim and this is an Arab-centric blog, but your assumption that I (or any Kfester) don't hold different discussions elsewhere is just ridiculous.
And why the FUCK is a woman kinky for talking about sex but a man is sexist?
I'm an atheist…
Jillian, if you grew up in the US then you grew up with Western values. That includes Christian values. Whether you like it, or not. That value system will be with you all your life, no matter what your views on religion are.
I can't stand Christianity or Islam or Judaism, but my recognition that the practitioners of those religions are people and don't deserve to be discriminated against is what drives me to defend.
An atheist, defending religious people? Instead of attacking them? Well, that's got to be a first. I applaud your efforts, and encourage you to continue the good work
I, for example, may defend Muslims more in this particular forum, because Arabs are most often Muslim…
But Will isn't. Will is Christian. Will is the person who made this post.
…and this is an Arab-centric blog
Is it? I called that into question years ago when I first started reading this blog. It doesn't really matter, though.
…but your assumption that I (or any Kfester) don't hold different discussions elsewhere is just ridiculous.
And where do you get off, making assumptions about my assumptions? Or something?
And why would I even care what kind of discussions you engage in on other forums, which I don't read?
And why the FUCK is a woman kinky for talking about sex but a man is sexist?
Using the name of a sex act as an online ID does not qualify as "talking about sex", Jillian. And in my opinion such behavior indicates an unhealthy obsession with sex, with is another way of saying "kinky". Not to mention it being extremely immature. And that'd be true for both men and women. What would make it sexist for a guy is the specifics of that act, which if you don't know what it is maybe you should look it up, and if you do then you should know what I'm talking about anyway :p
Craig, values come more from family than from society. I grew up in an atheist household. I don't deny that some of my values are rooted in society. In that same vein, values can change.
Will's religion is irrelevant to whom he chooses to defend.
I too think the nickname is a bit juvenile, but I don't think the act is sexist in the least; in fact, it's highly rated by women themselves.
Jillian, your family got *their* values from the society they lived in, so you still aren't getting away from your Western/Christian roots
I don't think you'd argue that Arab Christians have more in common with Western Christians than they do with Arab Muslims, would you? Same thing. Likewise an Arab atheist would likely have more in common with an Arab Muslim than with a Western atheist like you.
Will's religion is irrelevant to whom he chooses to defend.
Of course it is. But it isn't irrelevant when one weighs his credibility. Seeing as how Will can't be directly offended by that headline as he isn't a Muslim, then we have to consider his outrage is motivated by thinking such a statement is morally wrong. However, he makes worse comments about Jews… so that is a non-starter.
I too think the nickname is a bit juvenile, but I don't think the act is sexist in the least; in fact, it's highly rated by women themselves.
Yeah, I was thinking that it would be sexist for a guy to use that handle because the woman is doing all the work. But come to think of it, it seems like it might be sexist for a woman to use the handle because in that position the male is reduced to little more than an interactive sex toy. Hmmmm. Well, anyway… still seems strange for somebody to be using an online ID like that.
I absolutely disagree with your first sentence. My best friends and boyfriend all happen to be Arab atheists, and we have MUCH MUCH more in common than I do with any Christian.
ok but you're still calling them Arab athiests
which is reinforcing that separation
between them and everyone else
No, those were Craig's parameters. They are Arabs and they happen to be atheists. I don't go around referring to them as that, this is for the sake of this particular conversation. Just like I almost never put myself into the "Western" box, but for the sake of this conversation, I am a Western atheist.
Funny thing – I have a lot more in common with my Christian Egyptian Coptic friend than any of my Christian Western European friends. Surprised me.
I absolutely disagree with your first sentence. My best friends and boyfriend all happen to be Arab atheists, and we have MUCH MUCH more in common than I do with any Christian.
My closest friend is an Arab Muslim (and she's not American). Does that mean I have more in common with her than with American Christians?
My ex-wife is Chinese, born and raised in China. Does that mean I have more in common with Chinese Communists than with Americans?
Jillian, it's nice to try to bridge cultural gaps. I fully support that. But if you think you've transcended the culture you grew up with, I think you are deluding yourself. That just doesn't happen. Even with immigrants, it takes generations.
No Craig, I don't think I've transcended anything. I think you know nothing of the personal culture I was raised with. I've already stated that I disagree with you on how values are formed.
And no, you twisted my statement with your idiot logic. I said I DO have more common with those friends than I do with any Christian, not that I have more in common with them because they are atheists. I was supporting my point that I have little in common with Christians.
No Craig, I don't think I've transcended anything. I think you know nothing of the personal culture I was raised with.
I don't need to. I'm talking about the human condition, not you in particular.
I've already stated that I disagree with you on how values are formed.
It doesn't matter if you disagree with facts. They remain facts. That's why they are called facts.
And no, you twisted my statement with your idiot logic. I said I DO have more common with those friends than I do with any Christian, not that I have more in common with them because they are atheists. I was supporting my point that I have little in common with Christians.>
I have no idea what you are trying to say but if you think you have more in common with people from other cultures than you do with people from your own, you are deluding yourself. I've known people like you before. My ex-wife's best friend was a white girl who grew up here in Southern California. All of her friends were Chinese. She spoke both Mandarin and Cantonese. She got a master's degree in Chinese Studies. She lived in Hong Kong for years. And yet, I had more in common with her than I did with my Chinese wife, her best friend. That's a simple statement of fact. We came from similar families, similar social background, same ethnic background, we grew up in the same type of neighborhood, went to the same type of schools, the list goes on.
If you took a close look at your Arab atheist friends and compared them to (white) American Christian friends and did an actual comparison of what you really have in common with both sets of people (and disregard what you *feel* you have in common with them) I'm sure you'd see the truth that is in front of your eyes. But, you won't do that. Because, you are special. You aren't like the rest of humanity.
Time to accept that you and I have very, very different world views and move on.
World view has nothing to do with this.
don't see a gap to bridge between myself and anyone, because it isn't there.
Lol. You're in for a very hard fall one of these days. Getting along with people who have a vastly different cultural outlook takes a lot of effort, on both sides. I should know. And I do know. You aren't doing yourself any favors by pretending that special levels of tolerance and understanding aren't required, because people who are actually quite different from you are not different at all.
"don't see a gap to bridge between myself and anyone, because it isn't there."
I didn't mean anyone, that was a mis-type.
Regardless, you're still wrong. You know nothing about my family, social background, neighborhood, or schooling, and have been basing the argument entirely on ethnicity and religion of birth. If you want to bring in those other factors as important, then we have a different story, and in fact, my family, social background, neighborhood, and schooling are still quite similar to that of the people I was using as an example!
I don't deny, Craig, that a way a person grows up influences their values. What I take serious issue with is the weight you are placing on religion as a factor. I come from people who have never set foot inside a place of worship and who intentionally avoided passing anything remotely Christian on to me. For you to say that counts for nothing is simply bullshit.
I don't deny, Craig, that a way a person grows up influences their values. What I take serious issue with is the weight you are placing on religion as a factor.
Only to the extent that religion influences culture, Jillian. I already stipulated than an Arab Christian who grew up in the ME will have more in common with an Arab Muslim who grew up in the ME than with a Western Christian. That's because in the Arab world, it is Islam that has influenced culture. In the West, it is Christianity that influenced our culture.
And just because your parents made a conscious effort not to expose you to Christian beliefs, doesn't negate over a thousand years of Christian cultural influences. Even the whole counter-culture revolution of the hippies in the 1960s and 1970s failed to do that
Just for you, Craig, I sat down and took stock of the things I have in common with those friends, and oh shit, I'm still right.
Also, I don't have any Christian friends. Not one.
Also, I don't have any Christian friends. Not one.
That probably explains why you have more in common with your Arab atheist friends than your Christian friends. Since you don't have any Christian friends :p
Time to accept that you and I have very, very different world views and move on. I don't see a gap to bridge between myself and anyone, because it isn't there.
Wait, I still don't get what Will's religion has to do with anything…? Seriously, where are you going with that ?
Sana, I'm just pointing out that Will's "outrage" seems very phony, considering he's not even Muslim himself, and considering he has no trouble whatsoever with demonizing Jews in much the same way that he is complaining about that tabloid demonizing Muslims.
I don't get why his outrage seems phony. Is your outrage at anti-Semitism 'phony' because you're Christian? (I'm making assumptions here)
Shafiq, I can't explain it any better than I already did. Will has a track record on this blog. And that track record includes behavior that is much worse than what he is complaining about in this post. If you want to act like you don't know anything about Will's past behavior and just take his comments at face value, that's up to you. I choose not to.
who cares
to comment number one in this thread….."you realize you're not Muslim?"
And, PS:
I love how this garbage rag equates “Muslims” with “the enemy.”
Pretty surreal comment, coming from somebody who obviously equates "Jew", "Neocon", "Zionist", etc with "the enemy". Seriously. That's like Twilight Zone material.
I've never seen "Jew" equated as the enemy on this blog. But even if it did happen, you can't blame this site. You can blame Israel for claiming to be representative of the world's Jews.
But even if it did happen, you can't blame this site.
Oh, I can't blame the bigot for his bigotry, eh?
You can blame Israel for claiming to be representative of the world's Jews.
youre going in circles you need to go slowly
you can't say everyones a bigot
you can't say everyones a racist…..not that racist really means anything substantial
I love how this garbage rag equates “Muslims” with “the enemy.”
Some of the more "respectable" rags do so as well, they just don't do it as crassly or directly as the National Examiner, their target audience being more "sophisticated." When dealing with rubes, the subtlety of the more "refined" anti-Muslim propaganda we are exposed to would be lost, so direct racism works best.
The second amused me in a very juvenile way but then inspired deeper thoughts. “Why Angelina is Hiding the Twins” it reads. Naturally, “twins” evoked the slang term for breasts — yes, I am part ignoramus.
Don't feel so bad, those were my first thoughts as well
But the montage of the words "HIDING THE TWINS" over a photo of Angelina's "twins" was meant to convey the double entendre visually in case anyone missed it.
While some celebrities no doubt relish this kind of perverse and invasive attention, I just read an article about celebrities buying up remote private Islands (of course, the islands aren't so private anymore) apparently to get away from it all. I wonder how long it will be before some jerk starts offering helicopter tours of celebrity islands?
Some of the more "respectable" rags do so as well, they just don't do it as crassly or directly…
Some of the more "respectable" blogs do as well, they just don't do it as crassly of directly (as KABOBfest)…
And that's in regard to equating Jews(code words: zionists, Israelis) and Christians(code word: Westerners) with the enemy.
The only good ones are the self-hating type. Or the fake ones like "Chaim Sugraman". Right, Will? Right, Sean?
Do you guys even own mirrors?
I have never seen anyone on this site describe Jews as the enemy, nor have they described Israelis as the enemy, nor do they equate Jews with Israelis or Zionists with Jews. It's Zionists who do that.
Go ply your low-grade "anti-Semitism" canard somewhere else, Craig. You suck at being a tool and your agenda is as transparent as the space between your ears.
You're so full of shit, Sean. I doubt you even buy any of that pablum you are peddling, yourself.
I hate looking at myself in the mirror my eyes do a really weird thing
ok i need to stop talking to you im done
thanks, ill talk to you later
i wasnt smiling
Sean, that was some of most ludicrous and incomprehensible nonsense i've ever read. L'hitraot!
I forget, on purpose
I'm going to keep doing that automatically if you leave me to figure things out by myself
why is that happening
Whatever the problem was you fixed it, even my dad could tell, he doesn't even care who you are, he wants to hear about you
wow. When I read the title of this post I thought you were referring to NEWSWEEK's issue this week which is 'WHAT TO READ NOW'
subhanallah.
[...] I did some Googling later in the day and found this — See the cover for yourself. [...]
Whoops, tried to comment before, not sure what happened. Thanks for posting this, I share your sentiments.
Here's a working link to my related blog post::
http://thestabbingpen.com/2009/07/02/72-national-...
Nazi Will says: all media even slightly offensive to Muslims must be removed and destroyed. All hail Allah! You Will submit!
yawn
I don't see the big deal about all of this