“Removal” of Israeli Checkpoints: Just an Illusion
Over the past month, Israel has decided to ease some travel restrictions in the West Bank. Israeli authorities have put steps in place around the cities of Ramallah, Nablus, Qalqilya and Jericho. Today, for example, the IDF announced it would open foot traffic at the Hawara checkpoint near Nablus. In some cases, Israeli authorities have claimed to “remove” checkpoints or roadblocks altogether. However, has that really been the case?
In an update on movement and access in the West Bank released by the UN’s Office for Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) today they report that the infrastructure of several checkpoints continue to exist and some checkpoints continue to be manned by IDF soldiers.
According to the report, in Nablus only one (Asira Ash Shamaliya checkpoint) of the seven checkpoints controlling access to the city is no longer staffed on a permanent basis and only partial infrastructure has been removed. However, two gates near the checkpoint remain in place and Israeli soldiers continue to perform randoms checks there.
In Qalqilya, one of the two checkpoints there was completely dismantled while the other has its infrastructure still in place. Israeli soldiers occasionally man that checkpoint.
The Atara checkpoint near Ramallah still has most of its infrastructure still in place. That’s contrary to what the IDF said in the first week of June in which they claimed the checkpoint will be completely dismantled. OCHA reports that random searches continue to occur there “for several hours every week.”
Even with the news today that the Hawara checkpoint will be opened to Palestinian foot traffic, IDF soldiers will continue to man the checkpoint and carry out random searches.
So, there seems to be a pattern involving these “easing of restrictions” that the IDF is carrying out. They’re allowing people and vehicles to move somewhat easily but at the same time they continue to conduct random searches whenever they see fit.
Is this a real improvement? Let’s put these measures in perspective. According to OCHA, there are currently 613 “closure obstacles” within the West Bank. This is after the recent changes taken by the IDF. Of those obstacles, 68 are permanently staffed checkpoints. 522 are “unstaffed obstacles,” which include roadblocks, earthmounds, earth walls, road barriers, road gates and trenches and 23 are “partial checkpoints.”
All of these 614 “obstacles” do not include the checkpoints along the Green Line that also include access to East Jerusalem. They also do not include the additional 84 obstacles in the city of Hebron, the 63 “Barrier gates” and the random “flying” checkpoints that take place all across the West Bank.
These so-called improvements are just a drop in the bucket. They’ve provided only marginal relief to some parts of the West Bank. It’s going to take the complete removal of checkpoints and IDF soldiers to seriously improve the lives of Palestinians in the West Bank. However, I won’t hold my breath.
You're right. It's just an illusion, a publicity stunt really, to show the world: "Oh, hey, we're doing something for the Palestinians. By the way, they should relinquish 70% of their historic country to us and recognize that it's Jewish."
It's funny, because everyone knows that even if the Israeli government "dismantles" these (or any) checkpoints, they won't really actually leave the premises. It's like Gaza. They claim to have left it, but did they really?
Yeah nice try IDF
Guess what you actually have to talk to me
it is an AUTOMATIC REFLEX, i don't notice when I AM shuting myself up
I won't notice patterns in what I am saying unless you show them to me, not anonymously, use your NAME
I don't believe anything you write, even this, and it's just facts, it doesn't sink in, unless you had signed it with "JASON"
It's not fair that you're making me type this on kabobfest
ok so my problem is that "I hold my breath"
i get that, obviously, but i dont know how to stop
i held my breath through that
the i dont know how to stop
whenever im talking about myself im wrong
or i dunno i couldve been right some of the time, if i tried hard enough?
but ok lets say someone has been trying something and it hasnt worked for 20 years
that someone needs major help
i said 20 years because I don't remember, whatever it is that happened
from what i can tell, about him, my dad thinks im back to myself when i was a baby/kid
what in the world would make him think something so ridiculous like that im 20 years OLD
Thanks, Nawal, for posting.
Whats wrong with Marwa
What have most of the comments to do with the article?
How would the US behave if Canada vowed the extermination of the US? ?Checkpoints? How can the IDF withdraw from an avowed enemy? Would be nice if the PA & Hamas & Hizbolah accepted the existence of the Jewish country so that peace could ensue and the IDF withdraw.
Only free men and women can negotiate, Jack.
If you want to see real negotiations that bring peace, then Israel must stop stealing Palestinian land, stop the aggression, stop the collective punishment of an entire population, stop its policies of discrimination and recognize the Palestinians as equal human beings.
Why should the Palestinians recognize Israel when Israel doesn't even recognize them??? The more Israel fails to recognize something called Palestine, its native inhabitants as of 60+ years ago and that these people have rights as human beings, let alone under the law, then maybe the PA, Hamas and Hizbullah will recognize Israel.
As far as I remember, Israel never recognized a thing called Palestine, probably because it wold undermine their own country.
Let Israel recognize them first and maybe the Palestinians will recognize Israel.
Only free men and women can negotiate, Jack.
Really, Carlos? I thought anyone in a position of authority could negotiate, as long as their partner was willing to talk.
If you want to see real negotiations that bring peace…
I thought that's what everyone wanted? That's what everyone is saying. Who doesn't want peace, Carlos? Name some names
then Israel must stop stealing Palestinian land, stop the aggression, stop the collective punishment of an entire population, stop its policies of discrimination and recognize the Palestinians as equal human beings.
A peace treaty solves all those problems. You want those problems solved, absent a peace treaty? Why? How?
Why should the Palestinians recognize Israel when Israel doesn't even recognize them???
Because they want peace?
The more Israel fails to recognize something called Palestine, its native inhabitants as of 60+ years ago and that these people have rights as human beings, let alone under the law, then maybe the PA, Hamas and Hizbullah will recognize Israel.
Right. It's strange that you don't call upon HAMAS and Hezbollah to recognize Israeli Jews as human beings, though. Nor do you condemn their gross atrocities against innocent Israelis.
As far as I remember, Israel never recognized a thing called Palestine, probably because it wold undermine their own country.
The Israelis aren't the only ones who never recognized a thing called "Palestine". Such a state has never existed.
Let Israel recognize them first and maybe the Palestinians will recognize Israel.
Right. And maybe if they just disarm themselves and invite the Palestinians to share Israel with them, Palestinians won't kill every Jewish man, woman and child living there. We'll never know unless somebody gives peace a chance, right Carlos?
"I thought anyone in a position of authority could negotiate, as long as their partner was willing to talk."
Anyone in a position of REAL authority and who doesn't depend on someone else to govern their own territory can negociate. Do you think Israel really wants to talk? They don't even want to listen! How can you talk when the other side won't listen?
"I thought that's what everyone wanted? That's what everyone is saying. Who doesn't want peace, Carlos? Name some names"
Israel, for starters. Look at Netanyahu and his complete flatout rejection of freezing settlements in a place on Arab land and which is to be part of a future Palestinian state. He also wants the Arabs to recognize the Jewishness of Israel? "F" that! It's like the French going to Algeria, telling the natives "This is France now" and the natives not doing a thing about it. The Algerians didn't buy that bull, and neither will the Palestinians, because in both cases, a foreign power came to occupy their lands.
"A peace treaty solves all those problems."
Did Oslo solve these problems? No! Oslo made it worse: more settlements, more checkpoints, less authority for the Palestinians. I'd also like to mention that is wasn't a Palestinian who assassinated Yitzhak Rabin because he was promoting peace with the Palestinians; it was an extremist right wing Israeli.
"Because they want peace?"
Israel doesn't want peace. All Israel wants is security, because they're so paranoid and frightened and they're the ones with the nukes. Who's the one putting up the walls, the barriers?
And if that means killing all the Palestinians to do it, I'm sure Israel would. It's life or death. As a side note: Hamas was created in part, due to Israel's help to counter the PLO (divide and conquer) and Hezbollah was created as a response to Israel's invasion of Lebanon. In both cases, Israel was involved directly in the creation of these groups, whose attrocities, you're trying to tell me, are far greater than Israel's??? Try Sabra and Shatila.
"The Israelis aren't the only ones who never recognized a thing called "Palestine". Such a state has never existed."
You're right, there was never a "Palestinian State," but the people living there were Arabs and the place was called Filasteen or Palestine. You don't need statehood to say that something is real or that it exists. Tibet isn't a country, and the Chinese will tell you it's China, but to the people living there it's Tibet. The people of Tibet are called: T-I-B-E-T-A-N-S. The people of a place called Filastine or Palestine (in English) are called: P-A-L-E-S-T-I-N-I-A-N-S. The British called is Palestine (The British Mandate of Palestine), the Arabs called it Palestine, even the ancient Israelites called it Filistia (land of the Filasteens).
"Maybe if they just disarm themselves and invite the Palestinians to share Israel with them, Palestinians won't kill every Jewish man, woman and child living there. We'll never know unless somebody gives peace a chance, right Carlos?"
You're right. If Israel would actually seek for peace, they could get it. One of example: Back in 2002, when the all Palestinians militant groups were about to reach and agreement to halt all attacks inside of Israel, in preparation to go back to the negociating table, Israel ordered a F-16 to drop a one-tonne bomb in Gaza 90 minuted before the cease fire took effect, which completely scrapped the deal and brought on Palestinian revenge. What did Ariel Sharon say about the incident? It was "one of our greatest successes."
Why is it that everytime Israel is on the brink of reaching "somthing of a cease-fire . . . [they] always go back to this experience; just when there's a period of calm, [they] liquidate."
Netanyahu and his buddies are sticking to their agenda of undermining Oslo and the two-state solution. You mention Hamas and Hezbollah in your words, but do you really want to play the childish game of who is the most evil group in the world or do you want to take steps to achieve peace? Sounds to me like you'd rather play the game . . . sounds to me like you're still a child.
Anyone in a position of REAL authority and who doesn't depend on someone else to govern their own territory can negociate.
According to you, then, there will never be peace in this conflict, because there's nobody on the Palestinian side for the Israelis to negotiate peace with. That's just silly
Do you think Israel really wants to talk? They don't even want to listen! How can you talk when the other side won't listen?
OK, have it your way. Less talk, more fight.
The rest of your ranting is about how to negotiate and achieve a peace settlement, which you claimed in your opening was impossible. Therefore, I will decline to comment on it. Seems like you are having an argument with yourself, and I'll leave you to it.
Israeli Strike Is First in Gaza Since Start of Cease-Fire
"Israel carried out an airstrike on Gaza on Tuesday night after its troops clashed with Hamas gunmen along the border in the FIRST SUCH CONFRONTATION since a cease-fire took effect in June."
(http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/05/world/middleeas...
Yeah, less talk, more fight. EXACTLY!!!! Look at the last Gaza war. The Israelis had planned this war for months, while they were talking to the Palestinians and you're trying to tell me that the Palestinians are the ones who don't want peace, who go and break their agreements?
I like how your arguments have run out of factual evidence and I appreciate your lack of material to counter or refute my points. You still fail to address Netanyahu, the actual situation right now, the settlements, the checkpoints, who goes and breaks their "agreements" and the question of whether the PA is actually endowed with any REAL authority.
I could go on, but continuing to debate you is just a waste of time.
Carlos 1
Programmer Crackhead 0
Correct link to article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/05/world/middleeas...
Really, Carlos? I thought anyone in a position of authority could negotiate, as long as their partner was willing to talk.
Tell that to Vichy France.
Article 7, in conjunction with Article 47 and Article 8, renders null and void those provisions of the Accords that ratify past violations of the Convention. The fact the PLO signed the Oslo Accords and in effect recognised Israeli practices which contravene the Fourth Geneva Convention is irrelevant in terms of Israel’s obligations. Israel cannot exonerate or exculpate itself from responsibility for these policies and practices by relying on the PLO’s ratification of the Oslo Accords pg 79 <a href="http://www.hsrc.ac.za/Document-3227.phtml” target=”_blank”>http://www.hsrc.ac.za/Document-3227.phtml
It’s going to take the complete removal of checkpoints and IDF soldiers to seriously improve the lives of Palestinians in the West Bank.
Israel is required by international law to provide security in territory it has under military occupation. If they dismantled their security checkpoints and withdrew their troops back to their bases, that would be a breach of the Geneva Conventions.
The only solution for this problem is for the Israelis to no longer be occupying the West Bank. There are only three ways I know of that this could happen:
1) Israel turns the West Bank over to Jordan
2) Israel unilaterally withdraws without a treaty, as they did in Gaza
3) There is a peace treaty, under the terms of which the West Bank becomes part of a Palestinian State and therefore the Israelis have no legal basis for remaining in Palestinian territory, or the West Bank becomes part of some other state entity.
So, take your pick. But absent any of those three scenarios… yeah, don't hold your breath. Israel has not just a legal right to have security checkpoints in the West Bank, it has a legal RESPONSIBILITY to.
Israel is required by international law to provide security in territory it has under military occupation. If they dismantled their security checkpoints and withdrew their troops back to their bases, that would be a breach of the Geneva Conventions.
LOL how funny, Israel ignorse over 80UN resolutions and countless of the so called Geneva agreements but will fetch one to its convenience!!!!!!!
Israel has not just a legal right to have security checkpoints in the West Bank, it has a legal RESPONSIBILITY to..
dude. you are SO FUNNY….Israel really cares about being legal in WHO'S TERMS? how many internatinoal laws has it broken? Legal responsibility….? Please define?
History begins at the year one chooses. Palestine was a large territory, not a country, before WW I. The Turks [who controlled the territory] chose the wrong side. The territory came under the control of Great Britain. The conflict between Arabs [mostly Muslim} and Jewish land owners had a long history of massacres when Great Britain finally left. AT NO TIME WAS THERE A NATION called Palestine!!!!! Jews and Arabs had lived on the land for millenia until then. Israel was determined by the UN in 1948 as a Jewish homeland, out of all the political conflict of the past hundred years in the region. The Arab states immediately declared war with the intent of 'pushing the Zionist entity' into the sea. NONE of the Arab states allowed the residents of the so-called west bank to create a nation. The people of that territory wanted to push Israel into the sea. To this day, the only neighboring states to recognize Israel and make peace are Jordan and Egypt. A state of war still exists with all the others, including the non Arab state of Iran. The Palestinian Authority still proclaims its intent to destroy Israel as does Hamas [who took over the peacefully exited Gaza] and Hizbolah. There can be no peace, IMHO, until the State of Israel is recognized, those that have vowed destruction renounce that vow, and peace can be negotiated. Sending suicide bombers, firing rockets, killing Israeli children, hiding weapons behind Arab children, etc are NOT the stuff from which a peace treaty can be made.
There are non Jews who are citizens of Israel that thrive. Some do not accept their citizenship and ignore history. Palestinians that have come to the US have generally done MUCH better than those who stayed behind. Those that stayed have done little to develop a State, seeming to nurse their sense of grievance rather than creating a State that can compete with Turkey, or Jordan, or Egypt, or Israel. EVERYONE would benefit if the facts on the ground were accepted by Saudi Arabia and all the Arab states.
Oh c'mon Jack! Not the "There was never a Palestinian state" card . . .
If it there was never a thing called Palestine or Palestinian, why did the British call their mandate over that same strip of land, the British Mandate of Palestine? What do you think the word "Filasteen" means? It's been in use for hundreds of years, my friend.
Example: choose any place in the world and let's say there's a group of people in this place; they have a language, they have a culture, they have a history, their have their traditions. They call this place, this place where they live, which isn't a "state" or a country like we have today, but it has cities and towns and villages. It exists. They call this place Shuland or whatever you want. Then another group of people come and they take this place over and say: This now belongs to us and we will call it Morabia. Does that change the fact that the native inhabitant, that the original people who were living there, in that same land, before the conquest, still consider it Shuland? That they reject it being called Morabia, because to them it's still Shuland???
The same thing happened in Palestine. To the native Arabs, it was and still is Palestine and to the world it's Palestine. To the Jews: It's Israel, but it still doesn't change the fact that Israel is built on Palestinian land. The only thing than changed was the name. But it's still Palestine and will forever be Palestine!
There can be no peace until Israel is removed. That may never be, and peace will never be. Arabia is for Arabs, not white European Jews. Square peg in a round hole, how obvious can it get?