Decision of Palestinian Leadership and International Pressure an Insult to the Victims
Yesterday, 2 October 2009, the Palestinian leadership – under heavy
international pressure lead by the United States – deferred the draft proposal at the Human Rights Council endorsing all the recommendations of the UN Fact Finding Mission (the Goldstone Report). This deferral denies the Palestinian peoples’ right to an effective judicial remedy and the equal protection of the law. It represents the triumph of politics over human rights. It is an insult to all victims and a rejection of their rights.
The crimes documented in the report of the UN Fact Finding Mission represent the most serious violations of international law; Justice Goldstone concluded that there was evidence to indicate that crimes against humanity may have been committed in the Gaza Strip. Violations of international law continue to this day, inter alia, through the
continuing Israeli-imposed illegal blockade of the Gaza Strip. The findings of the Mission confirmed earlier investigations conducted by independent Palestinian, Israeli and international organisations.
The injustice that has now been brought upon Palestinians has been brought upon everyone on this globe. International human rights and humanitarian law are not subject to discrimination, they are not dependent on nationality, religion, or political affiliation.
International human rights and humanitarian law apply universally to all human beings.
The rule of law is intended to protect individuals, to guarantee their fundamental rights. Yet, if the rule of law is to be respected it must be enforced. World history, and the Israeli occupation of Palestinian land has shown us that as long as impunity persists, the law will continue to be violated; innocent civilians will continue to suffer
the horrific consequences.
Justice delayed is justice denied. All victims have a legitimate right to an effective judicial remedy, and the equal protection of the law. These rights are universal: they are not subject to political considerations. In the nine months since Operation Cast Lead, no effective judicial investigations have been conducted into the
conflict. Impunity prevails. In such situations, international law demands recourse to international judicial mechanisms. Victims’ rights must be upheld. Those responsible must be held to account.
The belief that accountability and the rule of law can be brushedaside in the pursuit of peace is misguided. History has taught us time and time again, that sustainable peace can only be built on human rights, on justice, and the rule of law. For many years in Palestine international law, and the rule of law, has been sacrificed in the name of politics, and cast aside in favour of the peace process. This approach has been tried, and it has failed: the occupation has been solidified, illegal settlements have continued to expand, the right to self determination has been denied; innocent civilians suffer the
horrific consequences. It is now time to pursue justice, and a peace built on a foundation of human rights, dignity, and the rule of law.
In Justice Goldstone’s words, there is no peace without justice.
The justifications given by the Palestinian leadership regarding the decision to defer are inappropriate. Consensus is not required, the United Nations system works on a majority basis. Since the beginning of the UN, and over the course of the Israeli occupation begun in 1967, consensus has rarely been acquired. The UN was established to represent the will of the nations of the world; it is inevitable that there will be dissent and disagreement. Decisions must rest on the will of the majority.
As human rights organisations we strongly condemn the Palestinian leaderships’ decision to defer the proposal endorsing all the recommendations of the Fact Finding Mission, and the pressure exerted by certain members of the international community. Such pressure is in conflict with States international obligations, and is an insult to
the Palestinian people.
As human rights and civil society organizations concerned with rights and justice, we declare that we will double our efforts to seek justice for the victims of the violations of human rights and international law in oPt without delay.
Adalah * Addameer * Aldameer * Al Haq * Al Mezan * Arab Association
for Human Rights * Badil * Civic Coalition for Jerusalem *
DCI-Palestine * ENSAN Centre * ITTJIAH * Independent Commission for
Human Rights * Jerusalem Legal Aid and Human Rights Centre *
Palestinian Centre for Human Rights * Ramallah Centre for Human Rights
Studies * Women’s Centre for Legal Aid and Counselling *
Related posts:
- Raji Sourani Denied Entry to US
- No power, no fuel, no food, no justice
- Palestine Solidarity Activist Fought for Justice
- Gaza: raising us up from the terror
- Irish Congress of Trade Unions: Boycott Israel
Every time I walked by the Watergate, I would always take a moment in front of the Benito Juarez monument to read the words of the plaque which says: "Respect for the Rights of others is Peace." I think everyone, no matter where they're from or what language they speak, can understand the concepts of justice and peace.
Until the criminal Zionists give the Palestinians their full equal rights as full and equal human beings, they will never have peace. One day, I'd like to see the Palestinians get up and say: "We've had enough of this and we're not going to take it anymore!"
But with brown nosers and political prostitutes like Abbas and Fayyad, the cause is effed!
Posted by Los | October 4, 2009, 3:16 am<<I'd like to see the Palestinians get up and say: "We've had enough of this and we're not going to take it anymore!" >>
And then what? How do you defeat one of the most powerful armies in Asia. I mean yeah, Hezbollah did it. But for some reason Hamas don't seem to have the same level of military power (i'm assuming Hamas is the only force with a military worth taking about in Palestine).
No sarcasm intended; But the real question is "then what?"
Posted by OooKhalid | October 4, 2009, 9:55 am"And then what? How do you defeat one of the most powerful armies in Asia. I mean yeah, Hezbollah did it. "
And do you know how Hezbollah did it? they did it b/c Lebanese borders aren't closed to weapons and food and clothes and building materials like Gaza's borders are …. Thats the diff b/w having Syria versus having Egypt as your only border outlet i guess … Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah has said it many times: just open the borders … u dont need ot give the Palestinians weapons just open the borders and the rest of us that aren't so treacherous will do the rest
Posted by Ali | October 4, 2009, 9:04 pmI think you bring up a very valid point Khalid: what's the next step?
For starters, I'm of the opinion that the Palestinians themselves must demand change and accountability from their leaders (Fatah or Hamas). Until the people do that, nothing's gonna happen. They'll remain angry, frustrated, colluding and dealing with the Israelis indirectly. How many Palestinians do you see and hear EN MASSES protesting their leaders and their policies? How many Palestinians did we see demonstrating and protesting Fatah at their recent conference? NONE! At least Israelis get out and speak out against their government and its policies.
If the Palestinians don't do it, other Arabs and the world aren't going to do damn thing! The question I have and maybe you could help me is why the Palestinians don't come out and speak out EN MASSE against Fatah or Hamas? Why don't they march in the streets? F**K self-criticism, taboos and intimidation. Then again, maybe these are what keep them from actually protesting.
Posted by Los | October 4, 2009, 3:34 pmFor starters, I'm of the opinion that the Palestinians themselves must demands change and accountability from Fatah and Hamas leaders.
Palestinians won't be demanding anything from Hamas leaders, and they better behave…
Hamas 'harming Gaza opponents'
A rights group has accused Palestinian organisation Hamas of killing or maiming alleged collaborators and political opponents in Gaza.
It says the same violence has been inflicted on "opponents and critics" of the Hamas administration.
Many witnesses and victims are said to be too frightened to come forward.
But one victim told investigators how he had been taken from his home by masked men and shot in both legs.
Some of those killed are said to have been shot dead while receiving hospital treatment.
Amnesty has called for an end to the violence and is urging the Hamas leadership to set up an independent commission to look into its allegations.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 4, 2009, 3:42 pmFor starters, I'm of the opinion that the Palestinians themselves must demands change and accountability from Fatah and Hamas leaders.
Palestinians won't be "demanding" anything from Hamas leaders, and they better behave…
Hamas 'harming Gaza opponents'
A rights group has accused Palestinian organisation Hamas of killing or maiming alleged collaborators and political opponents in Gaza.
It says the same violence has been inflicted on "opponents and critics" of the Hamas administration.
Many witnesses and victims are said to be too frightened to come forward.
But one victim told investigators how he had been taken from his home by masked men and shot in both legs.
Some of those killed are said to have been shot dead while receiving hospital treatment.
Amnesty has called for an end to the violence and is urging the Hamas leadership to set up an independent commission to look into its allegations.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 4, 2009, 3:43 pmCriticize Hamas?
…violence has been inflicted on "opponents and critics" of the Hamas administration.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 4, 2009, 3:45 pmDefinitely! Accountability is the most appropriate start . Without honesty to the cause and to the people, no organization will have the support of the people. That is the single most defining factor for the Hamas victory in the recent democratic elections. But democracy has been hijacked from Palestine, with the help of America. And the ability of the people to demonstrate their protest in the future is bleak.
OK! assuming the Palestinian people have got their change and accountability. Now what. What course of action does the legitimate government (which the people have chosen) take.
Do they take the diplomatic course or the military one.
I am of the opinion that ethically all diplomatic course must be exhausted before a military action is taken.
However it's Zionuts Israel we are dealing with. They find no compulsion in keeping their words (or committing war crimes); we have to just go back to recent history, to the Oslo accord. Look what they did…. Disarmed the Resistance, Promising them a State. But after PLO kept their part of the bargain, Israel find no compulsion in keeping theirs.
Like Malcom X said, referring to the KKK – " If you and I would just realize that once we learn to talk the language that they understand, they will then get the point….if a man talks the language of brute force you can't come to him with peace. Y good night, he will break you in two, as he has been doing all along."
Israel is not sincere in a lasting peace. They are just buying time. Israel has been allowed like a primary-stage cancer for long enough. If it is tolerated any longer it will mean disaster for the Jewish and Muslim populations in the Middle East.
Now assuming the only viable option is a military one. How does Hamas go about and claiming present day Israel as Palestine. Hamas has softened its claim on all of hisorical Palestine and agreed to pre-67 borders within a truce with fixed time frame but Israel refuses to come to terms. Now what? What do they have to do to first to defend themselves against Zionuts aggression. Clearly Hamas doesn't have the technical not tactical asset for a minimum defense of Gaza, amply proven in the resent genocidal Gaza War.
Regarding your thoughts.. <<The question I have and maybe you could help me is why the Palestinians don't come out and speak out EN MASSE against Fatah or Hamas?>>
I wouldn't be so hard on the Palestinians. I think you will have seen recently on the news of Palestinians protesting against Abbas' compromises at the States. Even Fatah came out on to the streets voicing out against Abbashole.
Posted by OooKhalid | October 6, 2009, 5:42 amdude, why do you go to Watergate? You work in Marlyand!
Posted by Hanitizer | October 4, 2009, 2:27 pmHa Ha!
I don't go there now man. That was when I lived in DC, 'Tizer!
Posted by Los | October 4, 2009, 3:06 pmThis deferral denies the Palestinian peoples’ right to an effective judicial remedy and the equal protection of the law.
No, it simply does not. Law is a negotiation. If you immediately do not get what you want, you should not act like a child and throw a tantrum.
Are you incapable of understanding that the Goldstone Report may have been flawed?
Goldstone report unfair to Israel
…it has endorsed tactics of unlawful guerrilla movements the world over that purposefully endanger the lives of their own civilians in order to protect themselves from attack.
The Goldstone mission — named for lead investigator Richard Goldstone — was, from the outset, skewed against Israel. Its mandate prejudged the outcome of the "fact-finding" mission before any facts had been found, stating that "violations of international human rights law by the occupying power, Israel," would be looked into. Some of the four investigators were not neutral arbiters either. Professor Christine Chinkin of the London School of Economics, one of the four, signed a Jan. 11 letter to the Sunday Times of London before the Israeli operation had concluded, accusing Israel of war crimes.
The political bias of the mission was borne out in the report, which, despite its 575 pages, failed to find conclusive evidence of Hamas' extraordinary use of civilians and civilian infrastructure for military purposes.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 4, 2009, 2:56 pmFor example, the report makes no mention of the recorded incidents of Palestinian rocket fire from school premises during the operation, despite video evidence.
The mission also failed to find evidence of Palestinian forces using mosques to store rockets and explosives and said so in the report. But the Israel Defense Forces made public many videos showing Israeli air force strikes on mosques in which huge secondary explosions can be seen following the initial attack, testifying to the presence of rocket stores in the mosques.
The report also fails to mention that the Palestinian forces recruited children to conduct combat-support operations. A Jan. 9 report in an Arabic-language paper in Israel included an interview with Khaled, a child from Gaza. He said: "We the children … are fulfilling missions of support for the [Hamas] resistance fighters, by transmitting messages about the movements of the enemy forces or by bringing them ammunition and food."
Gazan residents explicitly stated that Hamas fighters forcibly prevented them from leaving their houses and shot at Israeli forces from the same locations, telling them that they should be happy to die together with the "holy warriors."
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 4, 2009, 3:11 pmIn and of itself, these points may be fair. But if the report set out to investigate the occupying power, why would/should it address in detail the occupied force?
But, even if you don't take that point. . .none of the objections about bias against Israel have actually answered the accusations. It's all very well pointing out others' sins, but at some point, the music has to be faced and responsibility for our own actions – whether as individuals or nations – has to be owned.
Surely you agree that the best way to demonstrate that the report was flawed would be too answer its accusations?
Posted by Abu Nuh/Carl | October 6, 2009, 1:20 pmif the report set out to investigate the occupying power, why would/should it address in detail the occupied force?
That is just the point, it was not supposed to just investigate one side, but BOTH sides of the Gaza war.
The bias has to be answered first.
By the way, this has been the closest thing to success for Hamas' s "CNN strategy" – the strategy of having many civilian casualties.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:00 amif the report set out to investigate the occupying power, why would/should it address in detail the occupied force?
That is just the point, it was not supposed to just investigate one side, but BOTH sides of the Gaza war.
The bias has to be answered and corrected first, presumably, because a biased and politicized report is useless.
By the way, this has been the closest to success for Hamas' s "CNN strategy" – the strategy of having many civilian casualties. It is an appalling strategy and shouldn't be allowed to work.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:03 amThey didn't include these allegations in the report because they're bullshit. Israeli always claims that any civilians it kills were:
A) Being used as human shields
B) Killed by the secondary explosions of Hamas munitions, and not by the nonlethal, humanitarian rockets, bombs and white phosphorous Israel drops on schools, mosques and universities.
They have never provided evidence of any of these allegations and indeed, what evidence there is shows that it is is Israel that used human shields during the Gaza massacre and other war crimes it habitually commits. The videos alleging "secondary explosions" at mosques have been debunked, showing the secondary explosions are caused by additional missles and bombs hitting the target. When an ammo dump is destroyed, there will not just be "secondary" explosions, but tertiary, quartiary, quintiary etc, etc as the stored ammunition "cooks off" (as the process is called.) It rarely if ever goes up in one big boom. Here is a video of the phenomenon in a tank hit by an anti-tank missile. Notice, that not only is there not an immediate "secondary explosion" but a long delay as the ammo inside heats up and finally explodes in a series of explosions. Every IDF terrorist video of mosque bombings shows one big boom immediately after the first explosion. These videos are proof of Israeli war-crimes and nothing else.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbxNvG2DEvI
More on the "secondary explosion" myth here:
http://detainthis.wordpress.com/2009/01/02/ap-may…
Posted by Sean2009 | October 7, 2009, 3:00 amawwwwwww more sand niggers want justice? cry me a river!
Posted by the anti-jihad | October 4, 2009, 9:34 pmHmm i don't know if as an arab i should be offended by that … i mean calling me a "sand nigger" really just compares me to a black person which is in no way offending though calling a black person a "nigger" is … and some people thought having a black american as a president signaled the end of racism in america (it's pretty obvious this comment was made by an american)
Posted by Ali | October 4, 2009, 10:13 pmAwww pathetic racist uses the "N" word to label Arabs . . . awwwwwww what a sad joke he's become!
Posted by Los | October 4, 2009, 10:46 pmGood responses to the anti-jihad guys. While I'm all for debate and respecting other people's opinion. . . perhaps in future, if this poster only posts insults and provocative comments, they should simply be ignored?
Anti-jihad, i hope you're not offended that I had to talk about you rather than to you in the above – but do you see how other commenters actually contribute to the debate, even if they don't necessarily agree with the opinions or the original poster? It'd be great, with respect, to have you do the same. . . Thanks!
Posted by Abu Nuh/Carl | October 6, 2009, 1:13 pmDoes this mean that anyone, on any campus, will ask for boycott against "Israel"?
Or will you just sit in a corner, moan, and lick your wounds?
Posted by Lick Your Wounds | October 5, 2009, 6:27 pmLinking to a propaganda article (DetainThis) really doesn't help explain anything with all their conjecture.
They have never provided evidence of any of these allegations…
Yes, there is evidence of Hamas warcrimes. Besides, the "investigators" did not investigate this evidence, choosing only instead to focus on Israel in detail, while making a general statement about Hamas rocketfire being a warcrime (and not examining all the other warcrime practices of Hamas).
The tank video really doesn't have a bearing on the weapon stockpile explosions, they are two completely different things.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:13 amLinking to a propaganda article (DetainThis) really doesn't help explain anything with all their conjecture. It is obviously an agenda-driven article.
They have never provided evidence of any of these allegations…
Yes, there is evidence of Hamas warcrimes. Besides, the "investigators" did not investigate this evidence, choosing only instead to focus on Israel in detail, while making a general statement about Hamas rocketfire being a warcrime (and not examining all the other warcrime practices of Hamas).
The tank video really doesn't have a bearing on the weapon stockpile explosions, they are two completely different things.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:13 amLinking to a propaganda article (DetainThis) really doesn't help explain anything with all their conjecture. It is obviously an agenda-driven article.
They have never provided evidence of any of these allegations…
Yes, there is evidence of Hamas warcrimes. Besides, the "investigators" did not investigate this evidence, choosing instead only to focus on Israel in detail, while making a general statement about Hamas rocketfire being a warcrime (and not examining all the other warcrime practices of Hamas).
The tank video really doesn't have a bearing on the weapon stockpile explosions, they are two completely different things.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:14 amCivilians are not legitimate targets, that is not the question, the question is why were the civilians killed in the course of war between Hamas and Israeli forces – and the answer, which you may find shocking, is that Hamas intentionally endangers civilians.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:19 amCivilians are not legitimate targets, that is not the question, the question is why were the civilians killed in the course of war between Hamas and Israeli forces – and the answer, which you may find shocking, is that Hamas intentionally endangers civilians.
Hamas rockets a war crime: Human Rights Watch
"Hamas forces violated the laws of war both by firing rockets deliberately and indiscriminately at Israeli cities and by launching them from populated areas and endangering Gazan civilians," HRW programme director Iain Levine said.
Gaza/Israel: Hamas Rocket Attacks on Civilians Unlawful
Launches from Populated Areas Endanger Israelis and Palestinians
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:23 amCivilians are not legitimate targets, that is not the question, the question is why were the civilians killed in the course of war between Hamas and Israeli forces – and the answer, which you may find shocking, is that Hamas intentionally endangers civilians.
Hamas Pulling Back Into Crowded Cities, Beckoning Israelis
Hamas rockets a war crime: Human Rights Watch
"Hamas forces violated the laws of war both by firing rockets deliberately and indiscriminately at Israeli cities and by launching them from populated areas and endangering Gazan civilians," HRW programme director Iain Levine said.
Gaza/Israel: Hamas Rocket Attacks on Civilians Unlawful
Launches from Populated Areas Endanger Israelis and Palestinians
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:25 amCivilians are not legitimate targets, that is not the question, the question is why were the civilians killed in the course of war between Hamas and Israeli forces – and the answer, which you may find shocking, is that Hamas intentionally endangers civilians.
Hamas Pulling Back Into Crowded Cities, Beckoning Israelis
"They're challenging the Israeli military to enter the built-up areas."
Hamas rockets a war crime: Human Rights Watch
"Hamas forces violated the laws of war both by firing rockets deliberately and indiscriminately at Israeli cities and by launching them from populated areas and endangering Gazan civilians," HRW programme director Iain Levine said.
Gaza/Israel: Hamas Rocket Attacks on Civilians Unlawful
Launches from Populated Areas Endanger Israelis and Palestinians
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:26 amCivilians are not legitimate targets, that is not the question, the question is why were the civilians killed in the course of war between Hamas and Israeli forces – and the answer, which you may find shocking, is that Hamas intentionally endangers civilians.
Hamas Pulling Back Into Crowded Cities, Beckoning Israelis
"They're challenging the Israeli military to enter the built-up areas."
The divergent tactics reflect the asymmetrical nature of the war in Gaza and the vastly different goals of each side.
More than before, however, the rockets are now coming from the cities and the refugee camps, where most of Gaza's 1.5 million people live.
Hamas rockets a war crime: Human Rights Watch
"Hamas forces violated the laws of war both by firing rockets deliberately and indiscriminately at Israeli cities and by launching them from populated areas and endangering Gazan civilians," HRW programme director Iain Levine said.
Gaza/Israel: Hamas Rocket Attacks on Civilians Unlawful
Launches from Populated Areas Endanger Israelis and Palestinians
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 7, 2009, 3:28 amExactly, how many times can Israel "accidentally" hit a school, hospital, mosque, church, water/sewage sanitation center, or civilian home? Did they also accidentally bomb the police stations, fire stations, sole ice cream factory (They actually bulldozed that one), the single University (including the female dorms), United Nations schools, and the United Nations food depot (a bombing they did with White Phosphurus ensuring that all the food was incinerated).
The Sudanese Government puts out the same press release bullshit saying that the bombing of civilians was an accident as well, so did the Apartheid regime in South Africa, and so has every other major human rights violator. You would have to be a complete dumbass to buy the Israeli line.
Just look at the death toll from the last massacre. 100 dead Palestinian civilians for every dead Israeli soldier. The numbers speak for themselves, and only a nutjob would have the nerve to say that they were "accidents."
Whats even sadder is that even after all the destruction, the Israelis won't allow the Palestinians to rebuild because Israel insists on maintaining their medieval siege on the Gaza Strip. Because the Palestinians can't rebuild their sewage and water sanitation systems (much less homes, schools, hospitals, and other buildings) there now exists a huge threat of a cholera outbreak.
<a href="http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1114473.html” target=”_blank”>http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1114473.html
Posted by Arayus | October 7, 2009, 9:32 pmGazan residents explicitly stated that Hamas fighters forcibly prevented them from leaving their houses and shot at Israeli forces from the same locations, telling them that they should be happy to die together with the "holy warriors."
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 6:22 amHamas admits it uses human shields
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 6:23 amUhm Eagle, that's not whats being said in the video at all.
I highly suggest you actually take the time to learn Arabic, it might actually make your propaganda, which was thoroughly debunked by Sean (and is constantly debunked on a daily basis) actually seem slightly more plausible.
Furthermore, it was proven that Israel actually used Palestinian children as human shields, and that its a constant practice amongst the IDF to do so.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/jan/02/israe…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/mar/23/gaza-…
Posted by Arayus | October 10, 2009, 7:42 pmAgain…
Gazan residents explicitly stated that Hamas fighters forcibly prevented them from leaving their houses and shot at Israeli forces from the same locations, telling them that they should be happy to die together with the "holy warriors."
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 1:24 amWere you able to comprehend THIS?
Was the information able to absorb through all your brainwashing?
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 1:27 amSo it is your contention that Hamas does not use civilians?
that's not whats being said in the video at all.
"For the Palestinian people death became an industry, at which women excel and so do all people on this land: the elderly excel, the Jihad fighters excel, and the children excel. Accordingly [Palestinians] created a human shield of women, children, the elderly and the Jihad fighters againset the Zionist bombing machine, as they were saying to the Zionist enemy: We desire death as you desire Life. "
But nevermind what they say, just look at WHAT THEY DO.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 1:24 amUhhh Arayus, the video shows Hamas stating they use civilians. I highly suggest you learn just exactly what it is that you support.
Furthermore, your propaganda has been repeatedly debunked, and yet you seem oblivious to what's going on.
In regards to your articles, that may have happened, or may have been exaggerated (as the Palestinians are known to lie so much) but the fact is that those people are still alive. Hamas hides behind civilians, getting them killed.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 10:50 pmHamas Pulling Back Into Crowded Cities, Beckoning Israelis
"They're challenging the Israeli military to enter the built-up areas."
The divergent tactics reflect the asymmetrical nature of the war in Gaza and the vastly different goals of each side.
More than before, however, the rockets are now coming from the cities and the refugee camps, where most of Gaza's 1.5 million people live.
Hamas rockets a war crime: Human Rights Watch
"Hamas forces violated the laws of war both by firing rockets deliberately and indiscriminately at Israeli cities and by launching them from populated areas and endangering Gazan civilians," HRW programme director Iain Levine said.
Gaza/Israel: Hamas Rocket Attacks on Civilians Unlawful
Launches from Populated Areas Endanger Israelis and Palestinians
List of Hamas suicide attacks
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 6:24 amThe whole world knows HAMAS has been committing war crimes as a matter of routine for 20 fucking years, Sean. How come nobody does anything about it? And how come everyone is in such a big hurry to try to prove Israeli war-crimes when any reasonably objective observer would have to admit the evidence is pretty dubious and open to interpretation? What country has gone to war and behaved in a more humane manner than Israel? Can you name one? Even one? Doesn't it strike you as absurd that Israel is to be smeared for behaving better than any other country ever has on a battlefield, and at the same time we issue HAMAS a blank check for all the obvious and undisputed criminal acts they have committed over the years? You are a college student, right? Are you capable of doing any independent analysis at all, without being led to conclusions by your own personal bias Sean? If not, then what the hell are you doing in college? People like you dig ditches for a living, and you don't need a degree to do that.
Posted by programmer craig | October 8, 2009, 7:48 pmThe whole world know Israel has been committing war-crimes fro decades before Hamas even existed, and no one does anything about it. You consider the findings of multiple human rights organizations, including Israeli ones, the UN, the Israeli Supreme Court, Israeli soldiers admitting to war-crimes or witnessing them, or videos of Palestinians being shot, brutalized or used as human shields all to be "dubious and open to interpretation," but some grainy aerial video from the IDF showing what is most likely multiple projectiles hitting civilian targets in violation of the rules of war to be irrefutable proof of war-crimes by Hamas. No possible interpretation but Israel's fatuous ones need be considered, even when Israel's have been soundly debunked. Then you dare to call me biased, when I am clearly capable of acknowledging war-crimes that have, in fact, been committed by Hamas, such as suicide bombings and the use of Qassems against civilians.
Arayus said it best: you would have to be a complete dumbass to believe that Israel accidentally destroyed 15,000 apartment buildings in its attacks on Lebanon, and accidentally hit schools, hospitals, power plants, sewer treatment facilities, grain silos, 400 fishing boats, bridges, universities and markets in Lebanon and Gaza, all while trying to avoid civilian casualties. You would have to be a dribbeling fucking idiot or pathological liar to praise what a "miracle" it was that Israel allegedly managed to minimize casualties so effectively in Gaza, when they killed and injured more civilians in Gaza than the Germans did in multiple attacks against Coventry.
I shudder at the kind of cognitive dissonance you need to have to believe multiple, conflicting versions of the same event by Israel and its apologists, even after Israel itself has refuted many of the claims or admitted they were based on nothing. Israel has admitted that there was no mortar fire coming from the school it fired a mortar barrage at, killing 40 kids. But Eagle continues to post a video allegedly of Hamas firing a mortar from a different school over a year before the Gaza massacre as "proof" that Hamas fired a mortar from the school in question. even though its already been debunked. People that pathologically averse to truth and reality can usually only be found in psych wards, but they seem to enjoy a fair representation in the Zionut community as well.
Posted by Sean2009 | October 9, 2009, 10:47 pmYou can see the videos for yourself. You know that Hamas gathers rockets and weapons, and often those weapons cahches are stored in Mosques and schools and other civilian buildings. You know that they intentionally endanger their civilians and target Israeli civilians. The whole world knows this. It is pointless to try and make excuses for Hamas.
You admit Hamas blatant war crimes, as they are undeniable.
No one is claiming that Israeli forces behave perfectly, and no one can deny that bad things inevitably have happened. But to pretend that Israel is the problem and not Hamas is just foolish. To deny that the Gaza war resulted from Hamas actions is foolish.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 10, 2009, 6:48 amYou can see the videos for yourself. You know that Hamas gathers rockets and weapons, and often those weapons caches are stored in Mosques and schools and other civilian buildings. You know that they intentionally endanger their civilians and target Israeli civilians. The whole world knows this. It is pointless to try and make excuses for Hamas.
You admit Hamas blatant war crimes, as they are undeniable.
No one is claiming that Israeli forces behave perfectly, and no one can deny that bad things inevitably have happened. But to pretend that Israel is the problem and not Hamas is just foolish. To deny that the Gaza war resulted from Hamas actions is foolish.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 10, 2009, 6:48 amThe whole world know Israel has been committing war-crimes fro decades before Hamas even existed, and no one does anything about it.
Such as? I assume you mean deportation/evacuation/whatever of Palestinian civilians from occupied territory? That could only be considered a war crime if they had been deported to labor camps, which isn't the case.
…you would have to be a complete dumbass to believe that Israel accidentally destroyed 15,000 apartment buildings in its attacks on Lebanon, and accidentally hit schools, hospitals, power plants, sewer treatment facilities, grain silos, 400 fishing boats, bridges, universities and markets in Lebanon and Gaza, all while trying to avoid civilian casualties.
Every one of those is a legitimate target if being used by enemy combatants, or being used to aid the war effort in any way. The infrastructure targets are ALWAYS valid military targets. Period.
You would have to be a dribbeling fucking idiot or pathological liar to praise what a "miracle" it was that Israel allegedly managed to minimize casualties so effectively in Gaza, when they killed and injured more civilians in Gaza than the Germans did in multiple attacks against Coventry.
Are you even serious? Do you really think it's appropriate to compare World War II bombing raids that the Germans had to fly across the English channel with prop planes to conduct to a 2 month long urban warfare campaign? Well, hell… I can play that game too, Sean! The US killed more Japanese civilians in Nagasaki in 1 day than the Israelis did Palestinian civilians in 60 years. How many orders of magnitude difference is that? Anyone got a calculator handy?
Lets not compare apples to oranges, if you want to continue this discussion.
Posted by programmer craig | October 10, 2009, 8:02 amHamas Uses Schools and Ceasefire to Shoot Rockets at Israel
yet another example of how Hamas exploits its civilian population and civilian institutions as a cover for their terrorist operations. In this footage you can see how Hamas has located a rocket launcher between two schools and fired from it during the cease fire.
Hamas Terrorist Hides Behind White Flag Gaza 8 January 2009
, a Hamas terrorist plants an IED and then climbs into a house containing uninvolved civilians. Later the civilians and the Hamas terrorist exit the house waiving a white flag, at which point IDF troops approach and arrest the terrorist.
This is just one of many examples of how Hamas uses uninvolved civilians as human shields. This example is particularly egregious since the terrorist used civilians waving a white flag to try to evade IDF soldiers.
Weapons Horde in Gazan Mosque 13 Jan. 2009
Hamas militants were using a mosque, traditionally a place of worship, as a weapons depot and an area of operation.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 2:27 amWake up and smell the coffee Sean2009
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 2:27 amWeapons in Gaza Mosque Struck by Israel Air Force 1 Jan. 2009
the deliberate use of a place of worship as a military facility. Hamas uses the Palestinian people as human shields and exploits religion in its brutal campaign against innocent civilians.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 2:29 amMortar Bombs Shot from UN School in Gaza 29 Oct. 2007
Terrorists from the Gaza Strip fire mortars from an UNRWA boys' school in Gaza on 29 Oct. 2007. Hamas and other terror organizations in Gaza make deliberate use of civilians living in populated areas as human shields.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 2:37 amIsraeli Air Force Strikes Rocket Launcher 27.12.08
Israel Air Force footage destroying underground rocket launching site, rocket subsequently misfires. 27.12.08
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 2:39 amHamas admits it uses human shields
Hamas Exploitation of Civilians as Human Shields
A short film presenting visual evidence of the long-standing Hamas tactic of exploiting civilians as human shields, and civilian buildings as cover for terrorist attacks.
Cast Lead Video: Hamas Terrorist uses Children as Human Shield
a Hamas terrorist fires a rocket from the roof of a house, he then calls to a group of children accompanied by an adult to come to the entrance of the house to escort him out.
Cast Lead Video: Civilians Flee Hamas Terrorist as He Attempts to Use Them as Human Shields
a Hamas terrorist repeatedly attempts to use innocent bystanders including children as human shields. The terrorist approaches a group of three children who run away from him, then the terrorist lies on the ground feigning an injury. Afterward the terrorist walks into a civilian compound and approaches a man who pushes him away, he then enters a civilian building.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 2:23 amThe fact that you try to deny or make excuses for Hamas use of civilians is appalling and shameful.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 9, 2009, 8:59 amIt's strange how there is this culture of ignorance and denial among the supporters of Hamas.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 10, 2009, 6:33 amNotice how the nutjobs here rely on the same arguing tactics presented below:
http://jewssansfrontieres.blogspot.com/2008/07/ho…
Posted by Arayus | October 10, 2009, 7:27 pmI'm not an activists, Arayus. Never have been and probably never will be at my age. You, on the other hand, are an activist. Most normals consider "activist" to be a synonym for "nutjob". But that's neither here nor there. What matters is the degree to which you demonstrate you are out of touch with the real world when you – as an activist – imply that average law abiding go to work have dinner with the family go to bed at a reasonable hour try to get along with everyone else types are crazy. And you aren't. The world you live in seems kinda like a circus from that perspective, doesn't it?
By the way, just out of curiousity – when was the last time you bathed or washed your clothes? Shaved? Got a haircut? When your 50 years old and living on the street will you still think it's everyone else who is crazy?
Posted by programmer craig | October 10, 2009, 7:53 pmYou and your articles are funny!
No wonder you are so mixed up.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 3:05 amLOL. Don't give them any ideas. Look how quick they were to prove you right. That site overlooked item #5 though, which is repeating Items 1 through 4 ad nauseam, a persistent repetition being necessary to the success of the Big Lie.
Posted by Sean2009 | October 11, 2009, 5:44 pmThere are only 3 items on your recipe, Sean,
1) Ignore or justify any misconduct by Palestinians and other Arabs
2) Exaggerate any misconduct on the part of Israelis. If the case still doesn't seem convincing enough, fabricate additional evidence based on nothing.
3) Lie about international treaties as needed
Your formula is entirely reliant on dishonesty. The "zionist" recipe is reliant on telling the truth. Whose is better?
Posted by programmer craig | October 11, 2009, 5:59 pmI didn't read anyone lauding Israel's greatness, or anything about Saudi Arabia or Iran, or any of the other ridiculous things in that article? That article was completely unrelated, had nothing to do with anything here – it was totally irrelevant and yet Arayus claims the same arguments are used here. Strange.
It seems that Arayus really is a nutjob. His reliance on propaganda and thought-programming is truly sad, and weird. When the facts are inconvenient, he resorts to these things, willingly living in a fictional world.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 10:40 pmI didn't read anyone lauding Israel's greatness, or anything about Saudi Arabia or Iran, or any of the other ridiculous things in that article? That article was completely unrelated, had nothing to do with anything here – it was totally irrelevant and yet Arayus claims the same arguments are used here. Strange. They are not.
It seems that Arayus really is a nutjob. His reliance on propaganda and thought-programming is truly sad, and weird. When the facts are inconvenient, he resorts to these things, willingly living in a fictional world.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 10:40 pmThe Big Lie
Shocking!
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 10:45 pmPrecisely, this thread is proof of that.
We are talking about people who defend the massacre of innocent civilians and find ways to justify the ethnic cleansing of an entire people.
But then again what do you expect from their crowd =P
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFGit_tZDqs
Posted by Arayus | October 11, 2009, 10:15 pmThe liberals have been trying to make this link between supporting the war, and serving in the military. You don't have to be in the military to support (or oppose) the policies of the country – just like you don't have to be in government to speak about politics – the military operates on behalf of the country, and citizens have a right to weigh in.
This old argument has been "debunked" (to use an Arayus word) many times.
Arayus is resorting to this deflated old topic to distract from his support of Hamas, his justification and lying about their crimes, and his attempts to blame Israel.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 10:30 pmThe liberals have been trying to make this link between supporting the war, and serving in the military for years. You don't have to be in the military to support (or oppose) the policies of the country – just like you don't have to be in government to speak about politics – the military operates on behalf of the country, and citizens have a right to weigh in.
This old argument has been "debunked" (to use an Arayus word) many times.
Arayus is resorting to this deflated old topic to distract from his support of Hamas, his justification and lying about their crimes, and his attempts to blame Israel.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 11, 2009, 10:30 pm*yawn* you just debunked yourself.
"the military operates on behalf of the country, and citizens have a right to weigh in."
The citizens have weighed in; they want out of these wasteful wars. Most Americans don't want to be involved in wars half way across the world. Americans, Afghans, and Iraqi's are dieing in the thousands because you nutjobs insist that we must fight wars in 3rd world countries.
<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/26/opinion/26herbe…” target=”_blank”>http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/26/opinion/26herbe…
If you believe that its so imperative to be over there fighting and dieing, then you have the democratic right to enlist, just don't tell the rest of us that wars of aggression are somehow justified and helpful to our nation.
Oh and I had no idea I was a Hamas supporter.
Posted by Arayus | October 11, 2009, 10:51 pmARAYUS
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 12, 2009, 3:03 amARAYUS
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 12, 2009, 3:03 amIn America – unlike in GAZA – citizens may voice disagreement with the government, campaign against politicians, ect.
Most Americans? Depends on which poll you use. Naturally support for a war decreases the longer the war lasts. Public Attitudes Toward the War in Iraq: 2003-2008
Last March: In U.S., More Optimism About Iraq, Less About Afghanistan
AAAAAObama Gets Strong Support in Poll
There was widespread approval of Mr. Obama's plans for Iraq, with 80% approving of his move to pull out most U.S. troops within 19 months. Two in three Americans said the U.S. has accomplished as much as can be expected in Iraq, compared with 27% who said more can be done.
And the public is mostly satisfied with the results, with 53% saying the war has been successful, up from 43% in July 2008. Sixteen percent say it is very likely there will be an all-out civil war in Iraq when U.S. troops leave, compared with 40% who thought that in June 2007.
Some more Polls
And the fact is that "most Americans" know that Hamas is a terrorist organization, as does the whole (civilized) world.
Americans do not refer to either war as "a war of aggression" as you do, although many are against one or both. As for the rest of your positions, your kind are in a very small minority in America, so all this about "don't tell the rest of us" is really meaningless coming from you.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 12, 2009, 12:52 amOh and I had no idea I was a Hamas supporter.
I guess you forgot about this and this and this and this ?????
Always making the case for Hamas!
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 12, 2009, 3:03 amGazan residents explicitly stated that Hamas fighters forcibly prevented them from leaving their houses and shot at Israeli forces from the same locations, telling them that they should be happy to die together with the "holy warriors."
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 12, 2009, 2:55 amThe REPORT made it clear :
( the Security Council should be brought into the picture, being encouraged to consider referring the whole issue of Israeli and Hamas accountability to the prosecutor of the International Criminal Court in The Hague. )
and it's NOT over yet , Hamas and Israel must end the (Shaleet) fiasco as the report asked .
The US can do , but can't sell what they did
http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid1…
Remember , it's name (Game – changing – Diplomacy) ?
Posted by riskability | October 11, 2009, 12:53 amWell, despite all this bickering about who the real war criminals are, and despite all the one-sided stupidity of KABOBfesters, I'd actually like to see cases referred to the Hague. However, it seems to me that this report is tiptoeing around serious violations and is limiting itself to charges that are dubious and probably impossible to prove. The "big three" of war crimes are rape, torture and murder. To hear KABOBfesters tell it, there is ample evidence of torture and murder against Israel. Lets see some cases filed. And as far as HAMAS, they brag about the mass murders they have committed so that shouldn't be a problem. Lets get some cases filed.
How the international court (whether the ICC or a specially convened tribunal) handles the cases will tell us something about the objectivity of the "international community". And how Israel and HAMAS handle convictions will tell us something about them. And that's all stuff people need to know. And who knows? Justice may actually be done.
Posted by programmer craig | October 11, 2009, 4:37 pmPS-There doesn't need to be any "debate" in the UN on the matter. All that needs to happen in the UN is to have the evidence presented behind closed doors and then call a vote to approve the tribunal. Public debate in the UN is for purposes of providing entertainment and giving everyone a chance to grandstand and get on the news with their personal opinions about who the bad guys are. There are real bad guys out there. They need to be punished.
Posted by programmer craig | October 11, 2009, 4:43 pmDon't forget that most of Israels videos documenting them hitting military targets were hoaxes
Most? You provided just one example where oxygen tanks COULD HAVE BEEN mistaken for missiles – that may or may not be true.
So where are all the other "hoaxes"?
There are plenty of other videos documenting Hamas war crimes, a few of which I have linked for you here.
Posted by eagle007blogger | October 12, 2009, 5:52 amhttp://www.palestinenote.com
Posted by palestine note | January 15, 2010, 5:28 amMY STORY… http://edschultz.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=63544” target=”_blank”>.http://edschultz.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=63544
GO TO:
http://www.youtube.com/user/rthorne2#p/a/u/0/73by…
WARNING!
With the extreme chaos in the Middle East and all the strange weather happing now!
Jesus declared things are only going to get worse…Matthew 24
…
WAKE UP NOW!
Truth Revealed Ministry…..Revised
GO TO: http://web.mac.com/rthorne2/Site/TRUTH_REVEALED_M…
SEND TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW!
Posted by rthorne | February 12, 2011, 11:53 am